Originally posted by msgt
hehehe.. I was very surprised when I came here and saw that I had started a topic.. and a sticky topic too hehe..
I pulled all the comments about the post-Morrison (New) X-Men out of the old thread and put them into here. Earliest post gets given credit for starting the thread. :p
Well I didn't buy the issue, but I did read it in the comic store. Which is likely what I'll do with the next issue.
Well I don't know if I'd say the characters were real. I'm not sure what that even means.
If you don't have a sense of what real people are like, perhaps you should give up on internet comics discussion and try to interact with people in person.
I do realize its a style issue. I just do not like Austen's style.
I just did not like the dialogue very much.
I think the dialogue rang true for the most part. It's how people talk. It may not be huge grandstanding "I AM A GODDESS!!" kind of stuff, but these aren't those kind of characters.
As for style, are you meaning how it's "soapy"? Well, IMO, it's no more soapy than most of Grant's run. The relationships deal with in this issue are ones HE set up.
New X-men has been on the journey since GM run, and we all know they can't keep GM's evolution of the book (from dumpy super heros to a social sci-fi book) but here we went right back to a super hero book.
I just didn't like the feel of the book or get what was going on.
The fight with the robot in the mansion?? Emma Frost being hit in the head with a rock??
The book had gone so far and went so many steps backward in one issue.
I don't see Austen undoing anything Grant did in this issue. He pretty much picked up where Grant left off. Definitely not "going backward," either storywise or characterization-wise.
And MORRISON WROTE SUPERHEROES. His run was full of the usual superhero schtick, and you know why? Because the X-Men are fucking superheroes. Don't delude yourself into thinking that Morrison took them completely away from that.
And how the hell is being surrounded inside a burning building by an angry mob and digging through the rubble of the school "right back to a superhero book"?
They're not out saving the world. Hell, they're not even saving THEMSELVES. How is that superheroic?
As for the rock and robot...is it just that you don't like "your" characters being "treated" this way? Grant broke Emma's nose and made Cyke so insecure that it turned off his optic blasts, so things have been worse for these characters.
Cyke got his head rammed through a wall and it didn't seem to effect him as much as it should have.
He's unconscious in rubble at the end of the book. I'd say that that's "effected."
If he had a concussion, he could have been okay for at least a few minutes (all the fight seems to have lasted).
I'm still confused about the Cassandra Nova thing. But like I said if Xorn didn't know then its doubtful Cyke and Beast knew. I just wonder if this will get any explanation in the next issue.
Also remember that there's 150 years between this issue and Here Comes Tomorrow. Any number of things could have happened in that time.
And Ernst never displayed any of the needing-to-learn-constantly or inability-to-speak-well characteristics that Cassandra would have had at that point because of the body she was locked in.
And if you're going to argue that she somehow overcame that, then what was holding her back from once again becoming her old villainous self?
I don't think Emma was being real for just getting mad and running away. I don't believe that would be her style at all. She doesn't seem the type to just get hurt and run away.
Also not her style to fall for the boyscout, is it? She's attached now.
And it's not as if she ran off, bawling. She's hurt, she's mad, she leaves instead of trying to hurt Cyke back. Maybe not her style, but she loves the dork and wouldn't want to hurt him.
She need time away from him. So she took it.
I would make some more comments but they would likely cause some of the usual "No Austen does not write weak females" type of replies. I just did not think that was Emma. And realize I also hate it when someone says a character is out of character because then you put a character in a box - but even still I found that seen very predictable.. just because of how the X-woman are generally portrayed by Austen (and yes I am fully aware how some of you hate when people say that! But I think its True! :p)
Make the comments. I can argue them into the ground if I feel they're untrue.
Strong characters are allowed to have feelings. They're allowed to have weaknesses. We've never seen Emma truly care for anyone but herself up until now, so it would make sense for it to be against her usual spite and daggers attitude.
And it wasn't over the top. She didn't cry, she didn't fall at his feet, she didn't beg him to say it. She realized that Cyke may not be as devoted to HER as she is to him and it hurt.
So we got to see those feelings displayed in a way that I feel is in keeping with the overall character.
And if you think that that is "weak," then GRANT made Emma weak, not Chuck.
Also theres the argument about Jean's sacrifice that I've read elsewhere. Jean, seemingly, pushed Cyke toward Emma and the school in 154, but here he is still unsure. What role did Jean really play in the end of 154??
Jean wasn't talking directly to him. And even if she had, if the woman you were still a little hung up on said "No no, it's fine, go be with your new girl." would that really cause you to take a leap you're not ready to take.
From my perspective, Cyke's in love with Emma, but not ready to admit it to himself. Jean is just an excuse, because he loves her, but hasn't been IN love with her in a good long while.
He's also unsure about the school, still, so I think we have yet to see the effects of Jean's nudge, though one could argue that Emma's outspoken desire to rebuild the school is due to Jean.