Magneto's 1602

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Magneto's 1602

Postby Diablo » Sat Mar 06, 2004 1:18 pm

Paty, I know you've been really busy with Dave's illness and all, but did you have the time to read Neil Gaiman's 1602 ?
If you wanna see Magneto shine, you can read issue#7 ! :)

I also think Dave would like this story...although none of his characters do appear. But I heard somewhere Storm will show up in 1602's sequel. I hope Kurt will appear, too !
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Sun Mar 07, 2004 4:08 am

:mags:
OOOOOOOOOO...there's gonna be a sequel???GOODIE!!!
Yes, I have been following the series. Dave and i are big Neil Gaiman fans from the old Sandman days. wouldn't miss a chance to read his treatment of the marvel characters...even if it IS in some distant past alternate reality/timeline sortof...LOL
and YES!! Magneto shines in issue 7!!! Even to having his colors and HELMET!!! Sheesh! I bet Gaiman had a good bellylaugh at all us Magneto fans cheering when the book hit the stands!!! I bet he could hear the acolades from here!!! I understand he is in Australia aor somewhere around there right now on a tour or personal appearance or something of that ilk. I really cannot wait for the last installment of this particular series. And if there is to be a follow up arc, this is great! Not only is the writing top notch, but the Kubert art is lovely! Color comics with actual COLOR...not just beiges and grays!
I swear, the computer coloring on some of these books is the most dreary shit I have ever seen! What good is having the full range of color if all you are gonna use is pink, beige and mauve??? Pastel colors suck moose...sideways...with a straw!!! You have millions of brilliant colors to choose from and all you can use is brown and grey and occasionally a pale blue thrown in for emphasis or night coloring???PTUI!!!
there is richness and subtlety in the 1602 book...so rich colors don't have to be gaudy...they can add a wonderful richness to the art...which is, as I said, just great!...although I could wish for Mags to have more of his wonderfus WHITE hair!!! sigh...And I do wish the movies would get THAT right, and make his hair white there...instead of gray!!!
His hair is WHITE! people...get it right!!!
sigh...

The Gaiman stuff is sooo delicious. Rivka was, I know, crazed at first when he had Mags as the Grand Inquisitor...but he played this hand beautifully..doing his research, as i told her he would. My money was always on Gaiman...he is such a consummate professional with his research and his storytelling that the mind boggles!!! I love his work!!!
I only wish he would do more Sandman and Company stories...LOL...but I hear that is in the offing, too...so I may get my wish!!!Yay...and maybe I will oneday finish the sandman story I have almost half drawn here at home...LOL...which I lost heart to finish when he killed Morpheus. If he brings him back, I just may finish it!
OK, Neil, if you're readin' this, give me something to strive towards!!!LOL...Dave wants me to finish it, and I just found the pages the other day in a batch of stuff I was unpacking..LOL...so maybe....

Paty
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Diablo » Sun Mar 07, 2004 1:36 pm

I'm happy you and Dave enjoyed 1602. Yeah, Gaiman is a genious !
I was lucky enough to speak with him when he came in France. I've spent three amazing hours that day !

It's SO GREAT to see him write Marvel charcters... although I'd never had guessed he would kill [spoiler]Stephen Strange ![/spoiler] It seems he likes killing all his favourite characters... like Morpheus...
I don't want to sadden you...but I don't think Morpheus will ever come back. At last, he appeared in the Endless Nights book -such wonderful stories...

IF there is a sequel -Gaiman spoke about it but nothing is sure- I wonder how poor Kurt would have survived through Inquisition... And I sure hope we'll see more of good old bald Magnus. ;)
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Sorte Springer » Tue Mar 09, 2004 8:26 am

As soon as I read this, I rushed down to my local comic book store and bought 1602 part 6 and 7, I had no idea what the series was about before, but now I am hooked and will get the rest of the issues soon. 1602 Magneto is just pefect. OK, I wouldn´t mind if he had full head of hair, but he has a personality in that story that really hit the nail on the head, and when I comes to Magneto, personality means everthing. Besides, he has his trademark regal bearing, and wonderfully comanding presence.
Generaly, from the two issues I have read I would say that Gaiman has a perfect grip on the part of the marvel universe his writes about. The X-men in general are just right. Reed Richards and Steven Strange and the explanation of the marvel universe we get through them is the mark of a genius.

I have fallen for Neil Gaiman again.
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Tue Mar 09, 2004 10:56 am

:mags:
Yep...Gaiman is the best! He weaves so rich a story that it is just a delight to read him. You can enjoy the story on a basic level if you are not into the more erudite details of the histories he writes about...in this case, Marvel history... but he does his research...and all the characters ring true...just like all the Endless rang true! And on an advanced level of reading, there are subtle innuendoes and characterizations that just blow the mind! LOL...
Good fantasy writing is not just a good imagination...it is blood ,sweat...a lot of sweat...research, research, research...and a great respect for what is already known about the characters. If you stay in characterization, you can take the character out of even his timeframe and he will sttill BE that character! Which is exactly what Gaiman has done here. And done so well, too! Every single one of the characters he has written has run true to their classic canon characterization! He has not had to destroy the characters to bring this fresh look and intriguing storyline to our eager eyes!
Now, the only question I have, which will probably be answered in the next installment, is...Who the bloody hell is "Rojhas"...the indian sidekick of virginia!?! I mean... a BLONDE indian???gimme a break! But I havenn't figured out who Rojahs is yet...anyone got a clue? He's probably some esoteric character at Marvel that I have simply overlooked due to advanced age and creeping senility...sigh...but I am drawing a blank here.
Anyone else got any speculations?
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Nomad X » Tue Mar 09, 2004 2:16 pm

I mean... a BLONDE indian???
Paty
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Well, by 1602, Europeans had started having... "relations" with indians... Maybe he's only half Native American... I'm half Choctaw and have blonde hair and blue eyes...

And I'm thinking he's [spoiler]Captain America[/spoiler], also...
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Nightcrawler ZERO » Tue Mar 09, 2004 3:54 pm

Originally posted by Nomad X
I mean... a BLONDE indian???
Paty
:mags:


Well, by 1602, Europeans had started having... "relations" with indians... Maybe he's only half Native American... I'm half Choctaw and have blonde hair and blue eyes...

And I'm thinking he's [spoiler]Captain America[/spoiler], also...


True, but blond hair and blue eyes are recessive traits.... so he'd have to be the son of a blonde haired, blue eyed european and a half european/half native american who's european parent was blonde and blue

That is alltogether possible, too. Ultimately, I suppose it's more important to have the character be recognizable than to adhere to Genetics. Perhaps he's an englishman, who decided that he liked the ways of the natives better, and converted to they're way of life, much like Ka-zar?
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Diablo » Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:16 pm

Cap America's name is Steve Rogers. [spoiler]Don't you think Rojhas = Rogers ?? Just like Peter Parquagh= Peter Parker and Carlos Javier= Charles Xavier ?
I also think Cap is a time-traveler in this story. He's the real Steve Rogers. [/spoiler]

I'm waiting for the final issue now ! :)
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Tue Mar 16, 2004 10:10 am

:mags:
BINGO!!! You guys got it right... and diablo, your reasoning is flawless! for some reason, I didn't even connect there...drew a perfect blank...and I know Cap/Steve Rogers from long acquaintance with Johnny romita art! in the merchandising files I compiled at Marvel. LOL
I must be getting senile...it is obvious! duh...gray roots... Oldtimers disease settin in!!!
LOL
I am patiently waiting with worms all over my tongue...baited breath...heheheheheheheheee
Little fisherperson humor there...
sorry...
heheheheheheheeee
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Maelstrom » Wed Mar 17, 2004 12:49 am

Though it's a shame that they can't seem to do this in the "usual" continuity, it's still WONDERFUL to see everyone (especially Mags) so well portrayed in this. I'm enjoying 1602 more than anything else right now. And the very idea that there might be a sequel? :love :D

I, too, wondered just what the angle was with Mags when I first saw him as the "Grand Inquisitor", since this didn't seem to quite be in holding with the rest of his character, but, as with you, Paty, I just sat back and trusted Neil to know what he was doing. And I'm very glad I did. The hallmark of a good story is that you can't tell exactly where everything is leading (though I think everyone here knew that Mags had something up his sleeve when at the end of #6 he allowed himself to be bound in METAL chains... ;) )
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Diablo » Sun Mar 21, 2004 9:36 pm

Let the worms alone, Paty ! You're not senile ! :LOL

Maelstrom, Neil Gaiman said the story WAS happening in the "usual" continuity. The link isn't clear yet, but it will be, I think.
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Fri Apr 02, 2004 2:17 am

:mags:
Hey, Maelstrom...I love the monikker. Did you know that the Marvel character of the same name was originally designed by ME?
Mark Gruenwald came into my office one day and asked me what I would do costume wise with a character named Maelstrom. I asked him what was the character's power and he said something about him taking kinetic energy and using it...reforming it into a more actie form...that energy vortexes would always swirl around him. So I came up with a costume that became the basis for the character's costume...although the artist who did the first story with him butchered the concept of the costume cuz he didn't understand the flow of energy and material. sigh...
I just found a xerox of the original piece of art...LOL and it jogged my memory of the whole thing. I remember telling Gruenwald that he should have let ME drawe the damn story and having him agree with me...but If I remember correctly, those were the Shooter years and fat chance of having a female draw anything!!! Even getting a writing assignment was a tricky thing...it would only happen if he thought you would fail miserably...like in Jo Duffy's case. She proved him wrong but he badgered her off the book she saved anyway...sigh... I am not sure the xerox is dark enough to post or I would try to send it to the forum...but then again, I am not sure how to post things to the forum anyway...LOL...Dave is...so maybe I shall wait until he returns...

I was a bit taken aback by Gaiman portraying Mags as the Grand Inquisitor at first, I must admit. But then I sat back and said to my self..."Paty old bird," hence the worms..."Paty... TRUST Neil...he has never let you down in his understanding and research and complexity of storytelling.."
...so I soothed the ruffled feelings of other Magophiles that were being upset by telling them to TRUST Neil..and Voila! GAIMAN RULES!!!
I love his storytelling!!! I really do...It is just that good!I can hardly wait for the last chapter in the saga...if it IS the last chapter. Has anybody heard about a sequel??? That is such an exciting thought!!! I just know you are teasing us, Diablo...sequel, indeed!!!
A consummation devoutly to be wished...
LOL
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Rivka » Fri Apr 02, 2004 4:43 pm

Originally posted by Paty
:mags:
I was a bit taken aback by Gaiman portraying Mags as the Grand Inquisitor at first, I must admit. But then I sat back and said to my self..."Paty old bird," hence the worms..."Paty... TRUST Neil...he has never let you down in his understanding and research and complexity of storytelling.."
...so I soothed the ruffled feelings of other Magophiles that were being upset by telling them to TRUST Neil..and Voila! GAIMAN RULES!!!



Yes, yes he does RULE.

Not to mention any names of those people with "ruffled" feelings. Upset people, very upset people. People who didn't believe Paty when she said, "Trust Gaiman, he knows what he's doing. Trust the Kubert boys, they're okay." Some people just went ahead and wrote a letter to Gaiman anyway. >>sigh<<

And of course, some people are 100% happy to be wrong about Gaiman's 1602 Magneto. Happy, ecstatic, thrilled!

And yes indeed, 1602 #7 totally rocked. Paty was right, as she usually is. Trust Gaiman.

Awesome, awesome stuff. Just a little information provided, about "Enrique" the former Grand Inquisitor, and his children, and suddenly it's amongst the best portrayals of Magneto ever. After having to wade through the sewage that was"Planet X", how incredibly sweet 1602 is turning out to be, for Magnetophiles!


I love his storytelling!!! I really do...It is just that good!I can hardly wait for the last chapter in the saga...if it IS the last chapter. Has anybody heard about a sequel??? That is such an exciting thought!!! I just know you are teasing us, Diablo...sequel, indeed!!!
A consummation devoutly to be wished...
LOL
Paty
:mags:


I read somewhere that there might be a sequel but Mr. Gaiman won't be attached to it.

BTW, there are two really cool Elizabethean connections -- symbolically speaking -- to the Venetial Jewish community that resonate in 1602. One of course is Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice, which is highly controversial and there are some parallels with Magneto. But the other is the real-world inspiration for Shakespeare, his "dark lady" now thought to be Emilia Bassano, a daughter of the Venetial Bassano family, a family of musicians, poets, and intellectuals. Gaiman could have chosen another Jewish community, or he could have left things vague and bothersome, but he made the awesome statement that this early Magneto, in a way the ancestor of Magnus, was from the Venetian Jewish community, and it just resonates so well with his late Elizabethean themes. Including that of hiding, pretending to be something you're not in order to fit in, in this early 17th century society. (As Shakespeare himself might have done, since evidence points to him being a secret Catholic, or at least sympathetic to the Catholics trying to practice their religion secretly in England at this time.)

In 1602 we have GENUINE content inviting interpretation. We can have a rewarding and exciting experience unraveling symbols. We can happily decipher the multiple meanings in ithis ntelligent, pertinent, and entertaining multi-layered story. (As opposed to the shallowness and silliness of Morrison's NEW X-MEN, and the Morrison cultists who keep trying to explain the stuff he pulled out of a crack somewhere and threw against the wall as "meaningful" or "coherent" or "deep. )

Ahem, sorry. Trying to purge my system of the Morrison toxin, trying to put it behind me and look to the future.

Does anyone know when 1602 #8 is scheduled to ship?

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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Sun Apr 04, 2004 7:07 pm

:mags:
haven't the foggiest...I just WANT it!!!
but Gaiman NOT doing a possible sequal bodes not well. There are too many people at Marvel who could damage this very interesting depiction of Magneto...we've seen some of their antics influencing Ultimate and even Morrison's drek. It's that ol' Hardass virus raising it's ugly hairy head again...sigh Anyone know of a good antivirus?
It will all depend on who writes the sequal, of course. Gaiman has set up a deliciously complex cast here...and an interesting premise for an alternate past rather than an alternate future. TRUST GAIMAN!!!
I love that yummy Morpheus lookalike with the absolutely delicious mind!...and writing style!
LOLOL
I am too old for this stuff...LOL...but what a way to die!
Now if only Chris will bring back the REAL Magneto!!! I WANT THE REAL MAGS BACK!!!
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Diablo » Tue Apr 06, 2004 4:07 pm

If there is a sequel, I SO hope Gaiman will finally write it. Gaiman isn't just a good writer : he's a genious ! (the only one able to compete with him is Alan Moore, really)
Anyone who will write after Gaiman will surely suffer the comparison.

The last 1602 issue is late !!
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Sun Apr 11, 2004 6:38 am

:mags:
this is true...and the universe Gaiman created is uniquely his. I would not like to see anyone else attempt it. It is like no one can write the sandman crew like gaiman...so when he wanted off the book, they ended the series and had him do occasional Samdman stories as he wished to do them. and I respect DC for that decision. It shows they care about quality...not just quantity and greed. And, of course, it only whets our appetite for more Gaiman Sandman stuff!!!LOL
I was talking with Rivka earlier tonight and we were discussing that the truely great writers, like Gaiman, have solid fans who love their WRITING!!! But do not follow them around like slavish dogs snarling at any who disagree with their writing or dare to question it. They even talk to the fans, discussing the cocerns voiced or clarifying points that fans bring up for discussion..both pro and con. Controversy about their work does not frighten the truely talented. they know there is nothing so dangerous that it cannot be talked about. It is only the incompetent writers that restrict comment on their work to "favorable only" and set their dogs on any who would gainsay their offerings.
Writers of Gaiman's stature do not require worshippers...they require readers!
And, of course, their stuff is so multilayered and rich that it usually bears more than one reading...and much discussion...not to understand what is being said but to appreciate the multiple facets of the stories! No one ever has to "explain" a Gaiman story. It can be understood on many levels from the basic to the ultra historical/mythological...because it is so well researched and accurate to established mythos. One might almost say Gaiman is a learned archeologist/anthropologist of storytelling.
I know issue eight is late! Poop! I am soooo looking forward to it. But I shall be patient...all things come to she who waits! It's only a matter of time...
LOL I can wait for the good a hell of a lot more easily than I can wait for the bad!
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Diablo » Fri Apr 16, 2004 4:05 pm

Yes ! I've read the final issue of 1602!! :bamf
Paty, you're gonna love it so much !! :love:love
Yes, madam, the true and only Magneto shines again ! Thank you Mr Gaiman !
I think we really can expect a sequel. With Kurt, Ororo and Piotr, pleasepleaseplease !

Off-topic : I also saw the final episode of X-Men : Evolutions last sunday. In the end, after the battle with Apocalypse, Magnus [spoiler] is reunited with his children and... will be working with Xavier !! Too bad the show has been cancelled !![/spoiler]
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Panz » Tue Apr 27, 2004 4:09 pm

I just got #8 yesterday night and hastily read through it...which one should NEVER do with Gaiman LOL! you miss all the truly good parts that way. I love reading Gaimans works and hope like anything that he does a sequel to this. ZOWIE! this was good...I was all about kicking my lip and grumbling when I first heard the premise. I have yet to get #7 but my comic shop...the only one within 5 miles of driving *sigh* is a tiny thing that mostly carries anime and constantly forgets to order any thing other then Supes, Bats, Spidey and the Hulk... so I either have to try and re-order, or pick it up the next time I'm at a comics show. :X

Gaiman is a true bard and his stories feel weighty and yet inspiring...some people write like lead (yours truly be-times) but Gaiman writes with spirit and it continues to inspire long after you've read the work in question. What ever he writes is always prominent on my nearest bookshelf.

...even if he does resemble and over tall hobbit :p
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Magneto's 1602

Postby Paty » Tue Apr 27, 2004 4:50 pm

:mags:
He looks like Morpheus...from the Sandman series...or rather...does Morpheus look like him?
the first time I met hem I just stood there and told him he was Morpheus in the flesh... He laughed and said"Well...not really...I'm just not pale enough..."
LOL
Beautiful man...needs to be fed a little...LOL
and yes, his writing is so rich it is amazing.
I hear there may be a sequel but that Gaiman isn't going to write it which will be a BIG mistake!!! But we shall see what is in the offing with that. The whole series is wonderful and, Panz, send me your snail mail addy and I will get and send you a copy of number seven! YOU GOTTA READ IT!!!
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