So did we like Uncanny 409?

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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby BamfKat » Mon Jul 22, 2002 4:27 pm

I have no problem with him being religious. I really like that part of his personality. It adds depth and he would not be the same without his faith. I would not want him, nor anyone else to abandon their beliefs.

I have many friends who are religious but not a single one who wants to join the priesthood.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby BlueJubatus » Mon Jul 22, 2002 8:19 pm

lol, true that. Im very religious, but you dont see me making a b-line to join a nunnery:P
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i agree...

Postby kladyelf » Tue Jul 23, 2002 2:10 am

Yah... they're taking away his umm... "third dimensionality" or something, professing faith doesnt instantly mean = priest or missionary or something (though if they feel called...), and christians aren't dull, look at us lot on this board :D ;):spidey: incidentally :cerise::wolvie::prof: how do these little smileys work?:p:mystique::dazzler::wolfsbane::flash::fantastic: they're so cool, specially the animated ones :):mags::icey::chamber::rachel: ooo! a Rachel one too!!! :r2: :bets::yoda:
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Slarti » Tue Jul 23, 2002 4:25 pm

I've harped about this priest thing 'til I was blue in the face. ;) Frankly, I'm sick and tired of it. They've proved, over and over, that they know nothing about the process of becoming a priest. Now this business of his ordination is just utter shit.

I didn't mind him being religious, but to me it didn't add all that much to his character. He was shown to be the compassionate one looong before Claremont made him a Christian. In a way, saying that his religion makes him more compassionate is insulting to non-Christians -- like me.

That said, his religiousness was always just there, a part of his character but not the critical essence of his character. Now, they've tried to make it his defining characteristic and I think they've made him a hypocrite by doing it. He's a priest, yet he beats the hell out of people for a living. Seems diametrically opposed to me.

So they've ruined his character. Fans hate it. Many of the creators even hate it. Now, he's going to be in the movie, so they'll have to overhaul him to make him interesting enough for the crossover market. I'm just afraid they might make him even worse in the name of movie-izing him.

*heavy sigh*
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Panz » Tue Jul 23, 2002 4:46 pm

I was raised Catholic, but am now solidly agnostic..Im with you Slarti, in that I'm sick of the entire subject and wish that thay would all just drop it and give us back our character, why do the big dogs at marvy want him to be a preist so bad? it is dumb, dull and is killing the charcacter of Nightcrawler, why didnt they just stick him in limbo if they were going to do this, are they going to make movie crawler a priest....That would just not make sense.

I guess if they make him a priest in the movie and leave him a priest in Uncanny, I'll just quit reading comics altogether and stick to writing my fanfics...this whole thing has gotten me very depressed.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby BlueJubatus » Tue Jul 23, 2002 5:58 pm

I didn't mind him being religious, but to me it didn't add all that much to his character. He was shown to be the compassionate one looong before Claremont made him a Christian. In a way, saying that his religion makes him more compassionate is insulting to non-Christians -- like me.
-slarti

That bothers me as well. I have known pleanty of compassionate non-christians, some more so than people who merely professed to be. I HATE the priest thing and I really dislike how marvel has been redused to using stereotypes to define people.

Im also really, really worried about the movie depiction of him. If they do insist on the priest thing for the movie-which I think they wont- I would at least like them to do some actual research beforehand.:rolleyes:
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Slarti » Tue Jul 23, 2002 6:44 pm

I didn't mean to imply he'd be a priest in the movie. I doubt they'll touch that with a ten-foot pole. My worry is that to hype the movie they'll do a overnight revamp of canon Nighty to make him accessable to newbies drawn in from the movie. Just like Toad's redesign and Mystique's scales right after X-1, I'm afraid they might screw Nighty up even more than he already is by moviefying him.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby AmethystFaire » Tue Jul 23, 2002 6:47 pm

"I'll only beat the dead horse a couple of times, Mommy, I promise. Only a few good whacks." :D

Although all of my points have already been covered, I think, I haven't posted in a while so I'll just add my two cents on the matter of Kurt being "ordained" -- ABSO-FRICKIN'-LUTELY ridiculous.

I had no real problems with him being Catholic, since it gave me another attribute to relate with being Catholic myself, but felt that it wasn't necessary. Kurt was a wonderful, caring individual with strong morals prior to "Christianization" (LOL). I mean, it did add another trait to his character that many of the X-Men don't have (at least not to our knowledge), but other than that, nothing.

If one looks at the Kurt of twenty years ago and as he is now, and one wouldn't find many similarities aside from appearance. He's no longer a ladies man, never swash-and-buckles (LOL), but now spouts religious references, broods, and in general is a shadow (pardon the pun) of his old self. I mean, come on, he even uses the phrase "Mein Gott" in a totally different way now. :P

Having faith is one thing, becoming clergy is another.

Well, I need to head off and write another nasty letter to overskilled.com since I can't access my sites' files, AGAIN. :mad:
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby BlueJubatus » Tue Jul 23, 2002 6:48 pm

ewww, forgot about that -runs to dig up old excalibur issues for comfort- :P
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Bamfette » Tue Jul 23, 2002 7:11 pm

Originally posted by Slarti

I didn't mind him being religious, but to me it didn't add all that much to his character. He was shown to be the compassionate one looong before Claremont made him a Christian. In a way, saying that his religion makes him more compassionate is insulting to non-Christians -- like me.


i'm totally with ya there! touchy subject for me this very second as the Pope just arrived in town. nothing he has said (he is an extremely old man and said very little) but some of the things people are saying to that same effect... :mad: all the 'good' people are going to see him, some of the people talked to blaming the low turnout (20000) on 'those athiests' that we are 'ruining society' i can't believe some of the bigotry being displayed by some people. calm.. calm... like i said, it's not the church itself saying this it is people i ran into while running a few errands today. some i repeast *some* of them obviously actually held the belief that being christian made you somehow better and more moral. bullshit! you can't tell me i am less moral than anyonee simply because i do not believe in god.

That said, his religiousness was always just there, a part of his character but not the critical essence of his character. Now, they've tried to make it his defining characteristic and I think they've made him a hypocrite by doing it. He's a priest, yet he beats the hell out of people for a living. Seems diametrically opposed to me.

and by making it the core of his character, many of his other traits are simply forgotten, and that is what ticks me off most of all. so on one hand i am dissapointed with the 'recently ordained' line in 409, *atleast* Casey has given him a personality again, and allowed him do display some of his old charm, even if he did say it was just a front for the others sake.

So they've ruined his character. Fans hate it. Many of the creators even hate it. Now, he's going to be in the movie, so they'll have to overhaul him to make him interesting enough for the crossover market. I'm just afraid they might make him even worse in the name of movie-izing him.

*heavy sigh*


well, i guess you may have a point there... but if the movie crawle is more like his early days, i wont complain :D from what i have heard and seen of movie 'crawler he remains reletavely faithful to the *original* concept of the character... with some Ultimate mixed in. he sounds pretty cool, actually.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Tue Jul 23, 2002 7:51 pm

hey bamfette, i no, this is a smidge off subject, but, kurtlover and i agree that my story in fuzzy vision et... has got atleast some potential, i dunno if u've seen the plot yet, it's in of topic antics, but, i just wanted u to chek it out!
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby nghtcrwlr » Thu Jul 25, 2002 5:44 am

It is so human nature for a person to automatically assume the "self" as better than the "not-like-self" ... I was raised Catholic (although a rather strange kind I have turned out to be) and I lower my head in shame. Bamfette (or any of you) don't let those things those people said upset you. It's not true. You are very nice and you don't deserve that.

And nooooo, I don't want NC like this! This IS upsetting...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Booker » Thu Jul 25, 2002 4:15 pm

My only beef with the priest thing is that he can't be the ladies man he once was in the older comics. I loved that part of him, and they stripped it from his character with the whole 'I'm a priest!' thing. I demand more Kurt-flirting.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby silver_frosted_roze » Thu Jul 25, 2002 6:08 pm

I like Kurt being a christian... I do think they are seriously overplaying the priest thing. Part of me is wondering about how the Church of Humanity is playing in this thing. I'm hoping that they may be trying to draw a distinct line between a christian who works to follow their beliefs and those who claim christianity as a cover for what they really are... a hypocrite. I am christian... not catholic... but I have a lot of respect for catholics... the ones I've met are good people. One can claim to be a christian but if it's not in their heart then they really aren't. I was once told that when a woman gives birth she gets as close to death as one can without actually dying. I'm hoping what we're going through here is a simple dark time in which Kurt can stand back up and be stronger for it. (in my opinion that would best be solved by leaving the priesthood behind... but that's not my choice to make) Anyways. It would be so nice to have our silver tongued devil back...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby BlueJubatus » Thu Jul 25, 2002 10:16 pm

ladies man kurt-good:D
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Garble » Thu Jul 25, 2002 10:19 pm

I'm really sorry to hear people acting that way towards you, Bamfette. But remember it's not just a religious thing. Strangely enough I got a similar reaction when Dan Quale came to speak at my University. People are just wierd.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby kladyelf » Mon Jul 29, 2002 5:04 am

OK Fasheem Catholicism is a denomination of christianity, there are (i think) three major kinds: Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and Protestant (and all the many verstions that came after such things as King Henry the 8th of England created the Church of England such as baptists, lutherans, etc)
Please forgive me if i've gotten any of it wrong, as i've always thought "Christian is Christian!" No matter how you dress up when you go to Church or what you call youself, it is what goes on in the heart, the soul, that most central part of yourself that matters to God.
Bamfette, i'm sorry you had such an unfortunate experience, not everyone who calls themselves Christian is the same, beliving God, is vital to my life and it saddens me that in their enthusiasm (at least i hope that's it :/) to be "Christ's ones" some people actually alienate others :ashamed: :(
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To Stupidityyyyy - and beyond!

*after reading the latest gory/depressing "mainstream" comic* ....*sigh* that's it, I'm packin' up and moving back to the Eighties...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby kladyelf » Mon Jul 29, 2002 5:09 am

:) actually if anyone's interested, the works of C.S. Lewis are pretty good. (eg: mere Christianity, the four loves).... Did anyone else read "the Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe" when they were a kid? Mum & Dad gave me the entire set of 7 one Christmas, i devoured them in less than a week! :) And now i'm a librarian! :eek!: :) :rolls eyes: :P
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meddle not in the affairs of ficcers for you are malleable and easily .... O_o *stares* ooh is that a cookie?

Love your enemies - It will drive them nuts!

Crazy.... but in the nicest possible way....

To Stupidityyyyy - and beyond!

*after reading the latest gory/depressing "mainstream" comic* ....*sigh* that's it, I'm packin' up and moving back to the Eighties...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby kladyelf » Mon Jul 29, 2002 10:11 am

I thought 'twas the other way around. You can be Catholic but not necessarily Christian. The memories of my Catholic schoolgirl days are finally fading!!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

erm...
yeah i think youre right, but you can be both, it is dependent on your personal commitment/relationship with Jesus basically (see i said i wasnt an expert on this whole denominational thing!)
I went to a public school, (that was pretty traumatic, the teachers and library were good, but being a social outcast (or something) definitely sucked.) so i have no idea of what Catholic School life was like.... aside from a computing class i took in er.. year 11 or 12 i forget which.

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meddle not in the affairs of ficcers for you are malleable and easily .... O_o *stares* ooh is that a cookie?

Love your enemies - It will drive them nuts!

Crazy.... but in the nicest possible way....

To Stupidityyyyy - and beyond!

*after reading the latest gory/depressing "mainstream" comic* ....*sigh* that's it, I'm packin' up and moving back to the Eighties...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby silver_frosted_roze » Mon Jul 29, 2002 3:12 pm

while I attend the church of christ, I personally don't like to claim a denomination... I mean.. what's the point? Christianity was designed (according to what I've learned from the bible) to be a personal heartfelt relationship with God... Now you can be a christian and not claim a denomination... but you can go to the other extreme and claim one and not be a christian... I don't see denominations as a salvation issue... never have really... I willingly admit though that a lot of horrible things have been done in the name of "the church" but then we're only human... the Bible says to do the right thing and try to be perfect, grace is what's supposed to cover the rest of the road...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby nghtcrwlr » Mon Jul 29, 2002 9:06 pm

boy, sheemie, you really sound traumatized! :o You should have gone to the elementary I went to...fun, fun, fun! :D
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Postby kladyelf » Tue Jul 30, 2002 1:23 am

I don't see denominations as a salvation issue... never have really... I willingly admit though that a lot of horrible things have been done in the name of "the church" but then we're only human... the Bible says to do the right thing and try to be perfect, grace is what's supposed to cover the rest of the road...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------




ditto, .... wow this is a tangent eh? - actually a good book on grace is Phillip Yancey's "What's so amazing about grace?" it'll make you laugh, cry, think and wonder "WTSmeg were they thinking?!?!?"

aaanyway, *still* havent read #409 yet, *still* want my flirty Kurt back :cries: *still* posting here! :) :P ;)
meddle not in the affairs of ficcers for you are malleable and easily .... O_o *stares* ooh is that a cookie?

Love your enemies - It will drive them nuts!

Crazy.... but in the nicest possible way....

To Stupidityyyyy - and beyond!

*after reading the latest gory/depressing "mainstream" comic* ....*sigh* that's it, I'm packin' up and moving back to the Eighties...
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby Bamfette » Tue Jul 30, 2002 2:56 pm

if you want flirty Kurt back, i suggest you do pick up 409... he kisses Stacy and leaves her weak at the knees :naughty: it's brief, but there is a bit of flirting going on.

and ia appolagize for my earlier rant. i do completely understand that most catholics are not like that. but i guess emotions (thiers and mine) were heightened by the whole pope thing. plus i happen to live in a very religious community. it is sometimes tough to be an athiest here because it is rather expected that you be religious.
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So did we like Uncanny 409?

Postby silver_frosted_roze » Tue Jul 30, 2002 4:39 pm

s'ok... I can see how that's difficult... I've seen religious communities run a major bookstore out of the county for selling porno
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Ooo! plug plug plug ....

Postby kladyelf » Thu Aug 01, 2002 1:56 am

wandered over to ff.net today and read a new Kurt fic! whilst it doesnt say whether Kurt is a Priest or not it is a good argument for him to keep his faith and ditch the collar (relationship, not religion) ...
anyway its "conversations and beers" by hummergrey, with :) and :wolvie: and is rather nifty!
meddle not in the affairs of ficcers for you are malleable and easily .... O_o *stares* ooh is that a cookie?

Love your enemies - It will drive them nuts!

Crazy.... but in the nicest possible way....

To Stupidityyyyy - and beyond!

*after reading the latest gory/depressing "mainstream" comic* ....*sigh* that's it, I'm packin' up and moving back to the Eighties...
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