To Retcon the Draco Arc...

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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby The Drastic Spastic » Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:41 am

Test tube babies are not what I was thinking about with the grown in a lab scenario.

The alien thing is baffling though. So it isn't okay for him to be a fake half "demon" mutant because it screws up the whole mutant thing, but being an alien is okay? Waaagh! Illogical!
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby neling4 » Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:54 am

Not the Blob.

Erik Wagner is my #1 choice for dad, because it un-complicates things by going back to the original origin.

If that were impossible, maybe Doctor Doom??? Logan would be interesting, for sure, but not my first choice.

No aliens. No demons. And no ancient mutants made up for the occasion.

Just plain old, simple, dead-of-a-heart-attack while hiking in the Bavarian Alps Erik.

Now if it turned out that Erik was once a resistance leader during WWII, like Claus von Stauffenberg, that would be good. Perhaps that is how he met Mystique? It would also give him an interesting back story.
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Angelique » Fri Oct 02, 2009 3:21 pm

neling4 wrote:Not the Blob.

Erik Wagner is my #1 choice for dad, because it un-complicates things by going back to the original origin.

If that were impossible, maybe Doctor Doom??? Logan would be interesting, for sure, but not my first choice.

No aliens. No demons. And no ancient mutants made up for the occasion.

Just plain old, simple, dead-of-a-heart-attack while hiking in the Bavarian Alps Erik.

Now if it turned out that Erik was once a resistance leader during WWII, like Claus von Stauffenberg, that would be good. Perhaps that is how he met Mystique? It would also give him an interesting back story.


Somebody should fic about it! Or maybe he helped East German defectors or something like that!
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:12 pm

I thought I'd post my first draft for my letter... something to chew on for a little while.

I think our letters should be something in this order: 1. Why we like X-Men/Nightcrawler 2. Why we are disappointed with the way his parentage has been handled 3. Thank you for your time.

No suggestions for who his Daddy should be... just simple statement of why we don't like Azazel. Something like this, actually:

[quote]To Whom It May Concern,

I am a huge X-Men fan. I am also a relatively new X-Men fan, having only started enjoying them in the summer of 2007. I didn't start liking them because of the movies or their popularity. I found the X-Men because a friend of mine was determined to introduce me to comic books.

I went into that introduction with a grain of salt. I assumed that I wouldn't like comic books. For the most part, I was right. Popular superheroes frankly didn't appeal to me -- probably because I would have flashbacks to my little brother's Halloween costumes.

Then my friend introduced me to the X-Men. I love the stories, the characters, and the art, even though I am not generally a very visual person. What I loved, and still love, the most about the X-Men, though, was how real they seemed.

It was obvious that the writers had really thought about the characters. Each one was three-dimensional, not an easy, surface personality. Though they were printed on flat paper, each character had hidden depths that gave them form. These characters seemed real because they had the same kinds of idiosyncracies and quirks that real people have.

Characters have almost always been what draw me to a story. You can have the stupidest plot in the world, one that's unoriginal and has been told about a million times before, but if you have exciting, real, three-dimensional characters, I'm hooked. For me, the plot of the X-Men comics is simply a way to let the characters interact and grow.

But sometimes, plot can change a character for the worse.

My favorite X-Men characters, hands-down ,is Nightcrawler. He's not confined to just three dimensions. Sometimes it feels like he has ten!

Kurt's a swashbuckler, a damsel-saver, a kiss-stealer, a lover boy, and a "Blueberry Muffin." He's a devout man who lives by his faith. He's a defender of the weak, an upholder of the truth, and a friend to all in need. He lives in excitement with his eyes wide open and his arms in the air. He loves with abandon, carse for those who are close to him, even forgives those who do not deserve forgiveness. He is a man of morals and a man of faith, but he is also a man of passions. He's my hero.

Where plot coincides with character, Kurt Wagner is a masterpiece. Though through all his life he has been persecuted or attacked because people thought him a demon or a monster, Kurt has been understanding and forgiving, strong and sure because he knows they are wrong.

Kurt is a miniaturized version of the entire mutant struggle. Though he is outwardly different, underneath he is ultimately human. Mutants struggle for human rights because they are human.

Remember how I said plot can change a character for the worse? I truly believe the Draco Arc is slowly destroying Kurt.

In the Draco Arc, we discover to our horror that Kurt’s true father is a demon straight from hell. And no, you can’t rewrite mythology to make demons simply “ancient mutants.” Is Mephisto an ancient mutant? If you choose to dilute the character in that way, you will have ruined two characters!

By making Kurt half-demon, you justify every ignorant peasant who ever picked up a rock to throw at him. Kurt’s struggle for humanity is in vain, because he is no longer human. It is disrespectful to the character to give him a demon father. It is also disrespectful to his fans.

People identify with Nightcrawler like few other characters. Kurt’s fans understand that he symbolizes the struggle of any human being who has ever faced hatred and prejudice. Kurt is the essence of the old saying, “If they only got to know me better.”

But now, if they get to know Kurt better, they realize that… he actually IS a demon. Where Kurt was once a symbol, he is now a joke.

So, as one of Kurt’s fans, and with the group known as Bamfers and Allies Against Azazel Demon Dad, I ask that you would please take Azazel out of the picture. Kurt deserves something better than a demon for a father.

This should arrive on or around November 11, the day commonly purported to be Kurt’s birthday. What better birthday present could you give the Fuzzy Blue Elf than to give him back his humanity?

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Sincerely,

(My name)

[/quote]

Questions? Comments? Suggestions? Grammatical error? Tell me. Is this a letter that would help?
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Right across the lane from the demon and just down the wall from Wolverine.


RIP Kurt Wagner. You were the character who brought in me into comics, who introduced me and inspired me. Now your death has sent me away again. Wherever you are in the Marvel Universe, I hope its someplace pleasant.
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby neling4 » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:55 pm

It is a beautiful letter, Dedicatedfollower467: well-written and thought-out. My only suggestion would be, to reiterate what my informant at Marvel said, whose advice I quoted on the first page:
The most important thing is to be respectful in the request, while being short and to the point.


I'm not sure if a busy Marvel exec would bother to read the whole thing, in which case it would be wasted on him. If you could state your points in a more concise form, it might be more effective in this particular case.

The last half of your letter states pretty succinctly exactly how we feel and why, and what we would like to see happen.

As to mentioning a preference: I really think going back to the original origin is the simplest way to fix this mess. Kurt already had an origin, a perfectly fine and plausible origin, which the Draco arc retconned.



[Edited on 5/10/09 by neling4]
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby The Drastic Spastic » Sun Oct 04, 2009 8:37 am

I scrolled straight past it, then read neling's post. Then I loled.
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby neling4 » Mon Oct 05, 2009 5:40 pm

From Cup O' Joe Q & A:
Kiel Phegley: User neling4 had a few Nightcrawler concerns as well. Aside from wanting to see a more expanded role for Kurt in "Uncanny," he asked "Will the Draco arc retcon of Kurt's origin ever be revealed to be an elaborate fabrication by Azazel and Mystique, and Kurt's original origin reinstated? A large majority of Kurt's long-time fans, including this loyal Nightcrawler fan of 34 years, certainly hope so." Joe Quesada: We don't generally go seeking out things to retcon, but we'll keep it in mind, neling4. As for your favorite, Nightcrawler, having more screen time, you'll see him a bit more in "Uncanny" and taking a pretty big role in the "Necrosha" issues of "X-Men Legacy."


I also posted the entire article on another thread. I think this is encouraging! :)

[Edited on 5/10/09 by neling4]
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Wish-I-Had-A-Tail » Tue Oct 06, 2009 2:53 am

that's pretty awesome!

I didn't catch that they rewrote demons as ancient mutants for some reason. Maybe my mind refused to believe it.
Can I join BAADD?

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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby neling4 » Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:18 pm

Of course you may! You are now officially a member. Start composing your letter. :)
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Postby Saint Kurt » Tue Oct 06, 2009 8:35 pm

Here's a link to our "Save Nightcrawler" campaign thread from several years ago for an example of a letter and letter writing tactics.

A few things to note:
- The source of the information is specifically stated.
- I state my opinion.
- I back it up with things that matter to Marvel (critics and sales figures agree with me).
- I say exactly what want.

If I was doing this again, I would have made the letter even shorter.

Hope that helps. :)

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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby neling4 » Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:55 am

Thank you for the link, Saint Kurt.

BTW, I just voted for Count Wagner for Kurt's dad. Only Mystique is ahead of him in the poll.

Mystique :?



[Edited on 7/10/09 by neling4]

[Edited on 18/5/10 by neling4]
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Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Thu Oct 08, 2009 4:54 am

Okay, pare it down. Ha, and here I am reading Les Mis and complaining about HIS writing.

Will remember.

And actually I think Mystique as father could be a REALLY interesting relationship. But I would definitely vote for Count Wagner (though I'd rather he weren't a count... just a normal guy who fell in with whacko Mystique and had a bouncing blue fuzzy ball of joy). Honestly, I wouldn't have minded if they NEVER told us who his parents were... just left it safely anonymous. Or some completely random never-heard-of-never-spoken-of characters. People are too entwined in the MU. Everybody's related to everybody somehow or other.

Good ol' Count Wagner would be great.
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"A dedicated follower of nothing." -- graffitit artist in Brick Lane, London, England.
Right across the lane from the demon and just down the wall from Wolverine.


RIP Kurt Wagner. You were the character who brought in me into comics, who introduced me and inspired me. Now your death has sent me away again. Wherever you are in the Marvel Universe, I hope its someplace pleasant.
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Postby steyn » Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:11 am

People are too entwined in the MU. Everybody's related to everybody somehow or other.


well, how else are mutations going to spread without the help of incest :shifty
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:05 pm

steyn wrote:
People are too entwined in the MU. Everybody's related to everybody somehow or other.


well, how else are mutations going to spread without the help of incest :shifty


:LOL You just made my day, steyn. That appears to be the underlying current of feeling in the Marvel Headquarters these days.

If people are related to each other, I prefer the kind of gene-sharing that Mystique and Nightcrawler have. The only thing he really shares with her is skin and eye color. Possibly his flexible spine comes from her. But the rest, fur, fangs, tail, hands, feet, teleportation, is all him. Which is how he can be classified as a mutant. Don't make kids have the same power as parents-- it can be similar, but allow it to change some, to grow some. Otherwise it's boring.

Which is another reason why Azazel stinks.

I feel like I'm writing another novel, gonna shut up now...
~Def.

"A dedicated follower of nothing." -- graffitit artist in Brick Lane, London, England.
Right across the lane from the demon and just down the wall from Wolverine.


RIP Kurt Wagner. You were the character who brought in me into comics, who introduced me and inspired me. Now your death has sent me away again. Wherever you are in the Marvel Universe, I hope its someplace pleasant.
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Jeremus » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:02 pm

neling4 wrote:From Cup O' Joe Q & A:
Kiel Phegley: User neling4 had a few Nightcrawler concerns as well. Aside from wanting to see a more expanded role for Kurt in "Uncanny," he asked "Will the Draco arc retcon of Kurt's origin ever be revealed to be an elaborate fabrication by Azazel and Mystique, and Kurt's original origin reinstated? A large majority of Kurt's long-time fans, including this loyal Nightcrawler fan of 34 years, certainly hope so." Joe Quesada: We don't generally go seeking out things to retcon, but we'll keep it in mind, neling4. As for your favorite, Nightcrawler, having more screen time, you'll see him a bit more in "Uncanny" and taking a pretty big role in the "Necrosha" issues of "X-Men Legacy."


I also posted the entire article on another thread. I think this is encouraging! :)

[Edited on 5/10/09 by neling4]



Soooo, Neling......you have a BAADD agent working on the inside! :LOL
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby neling4 » Sun Oct 18, 2009 7:34 pm

Jeremus wrote:Soooo, Neling......you have a BAADD agent working on the inside! :LOL


We are everywhere! ;)

I have one last detail to iron out before we shoot off our letters, which, btw, I hope you are finishing up, because mailing time is coming up fast!!!

I was told to check the letters page of a recent comic book to find out who should receive these letters. I don't seem to have a letters page, however, I discovered that Axel Alonso is Executive Editor on the X-Books.

Does anyone have a letters page so I can verify my information?

Thanks!
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Postby Jeremus » Tue Oct 20, 2009 4:39 pm

I can't find any addresses to write to except the basic "Marvel Industries" or "Marvel Subscriptions".....
If anyone finds the correct address, please post it.

Also, should we right copies of our letters addressed to other Marvel people in charge....like not only to Joe Q, but to the Exec. Editor you mentioned and/or one of the Marvel head-honchos-in-charge-of-everything? Or should we just stick to Joe Q?
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Postby Angelique » Tue Oct 20, 2009 6:03 pm

Write to

Isaac Perlmutter
Marvel Entertainment Inc.
10 th floor
417 Fifth Ave.
New York, NY 10016
Meddle not with the heartstrings of fans, for we are powerful and hold your pursestrings.

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Postby Jeremus » Tue Oct 20, 2009 6:21 pm

Thanks for the address!

But who is Mr. Perlmutter?

[Edited on 01/19/09 by Jeremus]
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Postby Angelique » Tue Oct 20, 2009 6:44 pm

Mr. Perlmutter is CEO.
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Postby neling4 » Thu Oct 22, 2009 10:14 pm

I suggest that we can write to either or both Mr. Alonso and Mr. Perlmutter. Axel Alonso is the Executive Editor of the X-books, so he would be in charge of the creative decisions, and Mr. Perlmutter is Marvel's Chief Executive Officer. Joe Quesada, Editor in Chief and Nick Lowe, Executive Editor, are also a possibility. If you wish to write to one, two or all four, feel free. I don't see how it could hurt.

The address can be found here:

http://marvel.com/company/index.htm?sub ... urrent.htm


Marvel Entertainment, Inc.
417 5th. Avenue
New York, NY 10016


If you prefer email, that address can be found here:

http://marvel.com/company/index.htm?sub ... urrent.php








[Edited on 22/10/09 by neling4]
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Jeremus » Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:28 pm

I sent my letters....one to Perlmutter (please let me have spelled his name right on the envelope), one to Alonso, and one to Quesada. I was very nice and polite. :halo

(Hopefully at least one of them will read it before they toss it in "file 13".)
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Postby neling4 » Sat Nov 07, 2009 3:45 pm

I just sent mine.
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Postby Elfdame » Mon Nov 09, 2009 8:17 pm

Since I always do everything late, mine will go out today. But at least they will be sent (to Perlmutter & Alonso).
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To Retcon the Draco Arc...

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Tue Nov 10, 2009 1:01 am

Mine go out today too! (I think.) It should get there in time... (I hope.) Oh, well. Better late than never.
~Def.

"A dedicated follower of nothing." -- graffitit artist in Brick Lane, London, England.
Right across the lane from the demon and just down the wall from Wolverine.


RIP Kurt Wagner. You were the character who brought in me into comics, who introduced me and inspired me. Now your death has sent me away again. Wherever you are in the Marvel Universe, I hope its someplace pleasant.
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