How should nightcrawler return?

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How should nightcrawler return?

Postby Ziox » Wed May 05, 2010 2:56 am

So hey guys i know everyone is sad about kurts passing but like we have all known marvels use of the blue elf has been lacking for a long time. So give or take 2-3 years when Kurt makes his return how would you want him to come back?


I think i go for every one when i say kurt should be brought back as a leader for a new x team or a group of random heroes he put together.




[Edited on 5/5/10 by Ziox]
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How should nightcrawler return?

Postby Angelique » Wed May 05, 2010 3:03 am

I don't want him to come back. I think the death should have never happened.
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How should nightcrawler return?

Postby JackSkulls » Wed May 05, 2010 4:09 am

So far no one's agreed with me on this but I think Azazel should raise him and somehow control him, I think it would make for an interesting story!

I don't think anyone will agree with me on it either, but something along those lines would prolly get me to buy comics :shifty for myself atleast :D
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Postby Ult_Sm86 » Wed May 05, 2010 4:15 am

It would be interesting based solely on the fact that no one BUT Austen has written about Azazel, thus there is no background or idea/concepts written up in Marvel for any characterization for him. I mean, Chuck was such a shitty writer he barely gave him any dimension when he introduced him, I'd feel bad for the poor sap who'd have to use Chuck's work to springboard for something else.
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How should nightcrawler return?

Postby Diablo » Wed May 05, 2010 6:33 am

I think a great writer can make any character interesting, so... why not !

We only (*sighs*) have to get a talented writer, passionate about Kurt, on the X-books.
Quite a rarity.

I'd love to see him back as a leader too. And with the soulsword . I so like his links to the occult world (Margali, Mephisto as his nemesis, yes, even Azazel). That's something I really enjoyed about Darick Robertson's run. The Hellboy/Hellblazer angle.

The Nightcrawler series was my dream title and I miss it every day.


[Edited on 5-5-2010 by Diablo]

[Edited on 5-5-2010 by Diablo]
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Postby The Drastic Spastic » Wed May 05, 2010 7:48 am

Well, I don't think the problem with the current batch of X-Writers is passion or talent. They are an excellent group of writers. (Except Fraction, but he's at least okay.) They (most recently Diablo) say it's not the character that is important but the writer, but he was pushed and pulled in too many different directions until he broke. Broken toys don't really inspire much in the way of brilliance. Even the fanfic (paltry as it is) doesn't use him as he is NOW, in the MU as it is NOW. It just doesn't work. Death is a rescue, either as a mercy or a reset button, and I gladly accept either option.

I want him to come back immediately: Kicked out of Heaven for being a demon. Rejected by God. Angst! Rage! Violence! The struggle between his desire to do good and the undeniable evidence that "good" doesn't want him. He will probably even take up smoking, that's how conflicted and agonized he will be. HIS WHOLE retconned LIFE WAS A LIE. omfg. That would be suhwEEt. I would have sex with that comic book.

If Mike Carey wrote it, I would buy a dozen copies and have sex with all of them.
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How should nightcrawler return?

Postby Wahnsinn » Wed May 05, 2010 8:05 am

Not broken.

Oh, you meant the process! Ahem. While I'm definitely with Angelique that Kurt never should have died, we must deal with the cards we're dealt. (Boo!)

I think it would be fitting if Hope were to rezz him by the end of Second Coming; after all, he did save her sorry butt. If he has a touch of amnesia from the process, I could deal with that. Perhaps she can only bring people back while clearing out some of their baggage. Whatever Hope did to Rogue woke her up without all those other people farting around in her head, right? While she wasn't an amnesiac, she'd lost a lot of her baggage and ended up able to control her powers. Hope's rezzing could wipe away all Kurt's acquired angst, and he could start fresh from Happy Land and be the joyful swashbuckler again.
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Postby Diablo » Wed May 05, 2010 9:15 am

Drastic, Wahnsinn, I love your ideas.

Althougfh very different, both would work for me.

The only thing I'd add to your scenario, Drastic, is that Kurt shouldn't be depressed all the time.
He could still crack jokes, sound optimistic, remain smiling, and be torn inside.

That said, I still think his death wasn't necessary.
If there were things that you didn't like about Kurt's life, as a writer, you could just ignore them and develop the character the way you want to.

Sadly, Kurt didn't have any character development since the solo-series. There hasn't been any passion for the elf since Darick left Marvel.
Apart from James Asmus, of course. But he was only given two comic books to show us his (promising) skills regarding the elf.



[Edited on 5-5-2010 by Diablo]
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Postby kladyelf » Wed May 05, 2010 9:35 am

OK i'm with the train of thought that "he never should have died in the first place"

I am, however NOT in favour of the whole "kicked out of heaven" bit* :mad

but in regards to the whole "how should :) be resurrected/returned" bit here are some thoughts

1) Reality Manipulator
You know the whole "dead is dead" and "yeah we have a body" - but "whoops they're back!" Has been done before - anyone remember Betsy Braddock? killed by some baddie i can't remember, with sad people around her, subsequently autopsied, and buried and a while later her brother Jaime Braddock brought her back because he *missed* her. (Or something like that)
I can think of THREE extant reality manipulators right off the top of my head without trying... oh wait, he's dead, she's insane *counts on fingers* welll....

- There is something funny going on with the Scarlet Witch who is currently in Wundagore, with something mysterious in one of her rooms that Clint Barton discovered ...
- As far as I know that Gaea girl from Gen X didn't lose her powers so much as fall off the face of the earth so she's probably around the place somewhere
- Rachel Summers - give her the Phoenix force to work with and the elf will be up and flirting before you can blink

2) Time Travel
Perhaps it has been overused but it still can be done, goodness knows there's enough time travellers running about the place to need temporal traffic lights (and burly temporal policemen - dudes on timecycles hiding behind significant events - because you just *know* there's going to be one guy speeding, or another who's had too much to drink and decides to go back and moon Imhotep or someone else significant....)

3) Random Mcguffin
Cosmic Cube, T-O virus, medical nanites, Einsteins toenails, whatever, you know that there are things in the MU that can restructure reality for a Canadian dude who misses his friend.

4) Phoenix
Jean's supposedly coming back, *ducks thrown items* sorry but that's what i've heard... you think she'd want to practice it though so she doesn't cark it two minutes after coming back? and who else could she practice on but a nice guy who she knows pretty well?...

5) Crossover of the Month
Cmon' anyone want to see a White Lantern Nightcrawler? ... i wanna see one...

6) Logan goes and gets him back*
A-la that story in the Fantastic Four where the other three go off to Heaven to "rescue" Ben Grimm. As a Christian my reaction is: *facepalm*-gaaaahhh, but i have to (reluctantly) admit, there is a precedent.

7) Hope
Poor thing has to be good for something eh? perhaps she winds up as some sort of living mutant archive, or some kind of mutant gestalt, or SOMEthing...

8) Clone
I don't really count that as the Original Kurt coming back but someone mentioned it on another board and so i suppose it should be mentioned here. Should we call him Ben R - oops Stephan Wagner? :LOL

[Edited on 5-5-2010 by kladyelf]

[Edited on 5-5-2010 by kladyelf]
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How should nightcrawler return?

Postby Wahnsinn » Wed May 05, 2010 12:08 pm

There's also Layla Miller. She can resurrect things; the problem is they come back without a soul. :doh!
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Postby Elfdame » Wed May 05, 2010 1:02 pm

Kladyelf -- you had me lol-ing to the max. Loved it.

When I mentioned Jean/Phoenix in another thread, I was totes kidding. Had NO idea they would actually try to pull that off.

I think I'm safer if I stay out of touch as I have been. When my wild-@$$ jokes turn out to be serious Marvel plots, augh.
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Postby Angelique » Wed May 05, 2010 1:38 pm

Kicking Kurt out of heaven for being a demon is wrong on every level. He's not a demon, and the worst thing that ever happened to him was making him angsty. If I wanted angst, I wouldn't have dropped nearly every Marvel title formerly on my pull list.

Now if he met with God (and Dave!) and they said, "We don't care what those yo-yo's think. It's not your time yet," and they sent him back, that's cool. Yeah, I guess that means being kicked out of heaven, but for good reasons that will validate his faith, make him happy, and give no cause for angst.
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Postby steyn » Wed May 05, 2010 1:44 pm

you know, I haven't read through all of the posts, but how I would love for hims to return is....and hold on to your seat...I want him to return...in a puff of purple smoke :cracked.

that was a joke.

I say instead of bringing him back from the dead, just snatch him up from the past and put him in the present. There, problem solved.
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Postby Elfdame » Wed May 05, 2010 2:22 pm

Angelique wrote:Now if he met with God (and Dave!) and they said, "We don't care what those yo-yo's think. It's not your time yet," and they sent him back, that's cool. Yeah, I guess that means being kicked out of heaven, but for good reasons that will validate his faith, make him happy, and give no cause for angst.


I know some folks who were clinically dead IRL (like that _Life After Life_ stuff) and most of them felt they had a choice to come back. None of them wanted to return to this vale of tears, but each had obligations and so zipped back into their bodies. Nor were they "religious nuts," before everyone starts talkin' 'bout that angle. So it would be one way ... a dream sequence, or like the Winding Way where You Know Who was digging through Kurt's subconscious, where he saw that tho he was willing to sacrifice himself, it needn't be thus. And he could have the whole experience in Kitty's lap while she disentangles him (ok, I don't know how she'd get corporeal enough to grab it, as mentioned earlier, but ... this is FANTASY writing anyway, and we can always figure out a way, right? RIGHT??). :D
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Postby Angelique » Wed May 05, 2010 2:28 pm

Howzabout she merged her arm with Bastion's much like she had been fused in that bullet, puts it in permaphase, and gets it out?

Of course, the problem with that is that as of the end of X-Force 26 and the beginning of Uncanny, Kurt's been lying around on the ground dead for hours with people gawking over him. :(
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Postby steyn » Wed May 05, 2010 2:30 pm

*Nightcrawler gets up after a while and dusts himself off* "Just a little flesh wound."
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Postby neling4 » Wed May 05, 2010 5:08 pm

I'm going to wait until after I see the nonsense that is Uncanny X-Men #524 to make any predictions.

I remember they said we would cry over his funeral. Judging by the reviews I have read, I think they are right.

[Edited on 5/5/10 by neling4]
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Postby Wahnsinn » Wed May 05, 2010 5:43 pm

Angelique wrote:Howzabout she merged her arm with Bastion's much like she had been fused in that bullet, puts it in permaphase, and gets it out?

Of course, the problem with that is that as of the end of X-Force 26 and the beginning of Uncanny, Kurt's been lying around on the ground dead for hours with people gawking over him. :(


Well, I don't think it's been hours, but it's certainly been long enough to make reviving him by conventional comic advanced-medical means more than a challenge. Stupid bastards. :mad
Seriously, not one "We have to try to save him!" from anybody? What's up with that?
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Postby Angelique » Wed May 05, 2010 5:56 pm

It's been hours. He was still lying on the ground when Wolvie, Colossus and the rest got back from their cross-country road trip.
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Postby Wahnsinn » Wed May 05, 2010 7:08 pm

Angelique wrote:It's been hours. He was still lying on the ground when Wolvie, Colossus and the rest got back from their cross-country road trip.


Well, the death issue had the sense not to show him still on the ground when the others arrived. That would allow one to conclude that they had enough consideration to get his corpse somewhere decent. From the preview pages I saw of Uncanny, it doesn't look like the follow-up could be bothered with the same sense of decorum. Or they picked him up and put him on a tile floor somewhere. The joy of continuity gaffes. :doh!
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Postby Elfdame » Wed May 05, 2010 7:31 pm

Maybe they'll all wrap their arms around each other in a circle and sing "On Eagles' Wings" and Scott will break down and say, "AAAAUGH! Mea culpa."

Or not.
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Postby Jeremus » Wed May 05, 2010 8:03 pm

I'm still for time travel....the future is so screwed up that Logan goes back into the past to stop Nightcrawler from teleporting Hope to Utopia. Here's how it will go:

Logan shows up and tells everyone that the Elf is going to die.....all for a future that doesn't turn out the way they'd wanted. The mutant messiah is a false hope and he's gonna' "fix" the problem before it can get out of hand.
Logan walks toward Hope who cowers behind Nightcrawler.
(Snikt)
Nightcrawler faces his friend saying he won't let him do this, that he would gladly die for her-- not because she's some kind of messiah, but because she's a human being and because that's the right thing to do.
Logan says "I know, Elf." Then he looks at Hope and says "It ain't your fault, kid. But I gotta stop what's gonna happen. Nothin' personal."
Then he quickly turns and lunges.

Second to last panel: Scott falls to the floor looking up at Logan in shock.
Logan says "Well, not entirely personal."

Last panel: Scott lies face down in a pool of blood.
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Postby steyn » Wed May 05, 2010 8:07 pm

That.....that's beautful Jeremus, it brought a tear to my eye.
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Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Wed May 05, 2010 9:10 pm

YES.

Jeremus, YOU should write the Nightcrawler comes back scene. Wolverine going back in time to kill Scott Summers is so unbelievably UNBELIEVABLE but so perfect.

Except all of a sudden Logan has this great respect for Cyclops. Fraction is waaaaay too invested in the guy.

BTW I also agree with a "Stupid Bastion, it's not your time yet, you need to go back and help," from God angle. That would make me happy. But it would make the atheists mad, so I think a time travel is relatively less anger-inducing than the rest of the spectrum of ideas out there. So Logan, go kill Scott Summers!
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Postby Trigger » Wed May 05, 2010 9:24 pm

Dedicatedfollower467 wrote:Except all of a sudden Logan has this great respect for Cyclops. Fraction is waaaaay too invested in the guy.


Not since Kurt died he hasn't been. There hasn't been any actual confrontation, but it's pretty clear he's PISSED at Scott right now. He blames him for Kurt's death (as he should in my own opinion).

I'm not a big fan of the time-travel scenarios, but I'm willing to make an exception for your version of things, Jeremus. That would truly be an EPIC come-back!

[Edited on 5/5/10 by Trigger]
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