Teleportation Concept

All Nightcrawler, all the time! THE place to discuss everyone's favorite fuzzy elf in all his various incarnations!
Post Reply
User avatar
DZX9
Lubber
Lubber
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 12:20 am
Location: Elsewhere

Teleportation Concept

Post by DZX9 »

Kurt doesn’t dematerialize then rematerialize to teleport. As we all know he basically rips a hole into another dimension then comes back out in this one.

Now, granted, if he were to teleport into a thick wall he’d die. But think of this: If he were to teleport into, say a chair, the dimensional rift he’s creating would destroy the chair as he comes out. This could also be used to attack people (by bamfing inside of them). And I’m sure there’d be some limitation to the density of the objects, but it could easily be assumed this is possible.

Any thoughts (or facts I’m completely oblivious to…)?
DZX9
Gaz
Deck Swabber
Deck Swabber
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 6:41 pm
Location: Portland
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Gaz »

i'm pretty sure that bamfing into something would not destroy it. you're right, he doesn't dematerialize and materialize, but he doesn't physically come out of the demention, so he would be killed or at least badly hurt if he bamfed into a chair, as its molecules and his would overlap in the places where he hits it, which, though not possible to test, would most likey be hard to reverse or treat. It is the same with bamfing into people. it would hurt the other person, but him as well, as it has the same effect on him as it does to them. also, it has been said by many people that even if he had more deadly powers, his personality would keep him from them as he is a more peaceful person in a majority of situations.
DeviantArt | Live Journal
---------------------------------------

Stan: Can Eric spend the night?
Mrs. Cartman: No, I'm sorry, Eric is grounded
for trying to exterminate the Jews last week.
User avatar
DZX9
Lubber
Lubber
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 12:20 am
Location: Elsewhere

Teleportation Concept

Post by DZX9 »

Just ignoring his personality at this moment.

And he could experiment by taking a long pipe or cat with him and teleport next to a wall were it'd go in.

So what you're saying is he doesn't create a rift, but rather "phases" from one dimension to the next?
DZX9
Gaz
Deck Swabber
Deck Swabber
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 6:41 pm
Location: Portland
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Gaz »

A cat??? :puppy

*Watches the 'People for the Ethical Treatment of Lead Pipes' come marching in with flaming torches......*

That is true, it's odd he's never experimented by bamfing an object into something. Maybe he doesn't want to make the nightmares worse......
DeviantArt | Live Journal
---------------------------------------

Stan: Can Eric spend the night?
Mrs. Cartman: No, I'm sorry, Eric is grounded
for trying to exterminate the Jews last week.
User avatar
Maelstrom
Lookout
Lookout
Posts: 830
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 2:41 pm
Location: California, USA

Teleportation Concept

Post by Maelstrom »

I think, in one episode of Excalibur, he actually materialized inside something. From what I recall, it was a horrendous experience, from which he was fortunate to survive. :shocked

I'd think it would be a case of matter displacing matter. The liquids and gasses are far, far less "tough" then Kurt's body, so they get pushed aside instead. But anything that stands a chance at being as solid as Kurt will not be so easily pushed aside, and there's a great chance of molecular "mixing". Alloyed metals are fine, but organics do not mix well. The distuption tends to be terminal. Anything that "melds" with Kurt's body, from a piece of foam to a wrought iron rod, will cause such horrible cellular disruption that it would be like "cutting off" the limb or affected section.

I've used Kurt's t'porting as a weapon in one of my fics, using the physics rules that he is written by, as I would understand them. He can materialize things inside each other as a weapon, but the effect is incredibly destructive. The one time that he used it in the comic was against a robot of the Thing, when he teleported a chunk of equipment in the 'bot's chest. The 'bot didn't survive.

In my fic, he did something similar, materializing a long chunk of rebar in the middle of a robot/vehicle's torso. The rebar was moderately tougher than the ceramic exterior, so where the two collided, a hole was ripped. It was much more solid than the *ahem* "organic matter" driving it from the inside. :X The explosion inside the torso was messy to say the least, and the rod survived without incident. This appaling result would be the reason why Kurt wouldn't use this ability against living beings in the comics, as he doesn't believe in killing or maiming. (In the fic, the shock to his arms and hands rendered them useless for hours, further exacting a high price he would be less-than-willing to pay on a common basis.)
Eagles may soar, but weasels never get sucked into the intake of a jet engine..... :evil
User avatar
Orangatan64
Bilge Rat
Bilge Rat
Posts: 64
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2003 6:51 am
Location: Mobile, Al.

Teleportation Concept

Post by Orangatan64 »

Originally posted by Maelstrom
I think, in one episode of Excalibur, he actually materialized inside something. From what I recall, it was a horrendous experience, from which he was fortunate to survive. :shocked

I'd think it would be a case of matter displacing matter. The liquids and gasses are far, far less "tough" then Kurt's body, so they get pushed aside instead. But anything that stands a chance at being as solid as Kurt will not be so easily pushed aside, and there's a great chance of molecular "mixing". Alloyed metals are fine, but organics do not mix well. The distuption tends to be terminal. Anything that "melds" with Kurt's body, from a piece of foam to a wrought iron rod, will cause such horrible cellular disruption that it would be like "cutting off" the limb or affected section.

I've used Kurt's t'porting as a weapon in one of my fics, using the physics rules that he is written by, as I would understand them. He can materialize things inside each other as a weapon, but the effect is incredibly destructive. The one time that he used it in the comic was against a robot of the Thing, when he teleported a chunk of equipment in the 'bot's chest. The 'bot didn't survive.

In my fic, he did something similar, materializing a long chunk of rebar in the middle of a robot/vehicle's torso. The rebar was moderately tougher than the ceramic exterior, so where the two collided, a hole was ripped. It was much more solid than the *ahem* "organic matter" driving it from the inside. :X The explosion inside the torso was messy to say the least, and the rod survived without incident. This appaling result would be the reason why Kurt wouldn't use this ability against living beings in the comics, as he doesn't believe in killing or maiming. (In the fic, the shock to his arms and hands rendered them useless for hours, further exacting a high price he would be less-than-willing to pay on a common basis.)
Maelstrom, reading Isolation, and all of your other stories reminds me of reading any Michael Crichton novel. Are you a medical student, or just a medical info. junkie?:)

Also, when reading 'Crawlers bio, it says 'and a small amount of aditional mass around him.' Does that mean that he could teleport a chair with him if he were standing next to it?(A small one)
And has the effects of him teleporting too much mass ever come up in the comics? Does he just get a nosebleed, go into shock, or anything like that?
"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so." - Douglas Adams.
"The pen is mightier than the sword, and considerably easier to write with." - Marty Feldman.
"If toast always lands butter-side down, and cats always land on their feet, what happens if you strap toast on the back of a cat and drop it?" - Steven Wright.
User avatar
Maelstrom
Lookout
Lookout
Posts: 830
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 2:41 pm
Location: California, USA

Teleportation Concept

Post by Maelstrom »

Originally posted by Orangatan64
Maelstrom, reading Isolation, and all of your other stories reminds me of reading any Michael Crichton novel. Are you a medical student, or just a medical info. junkie?:)
:LOL Kind of both. I grew up reading my mom's medical textbooks. (Yup, I was reading about decibitous ulcers and meningitis when I was 6.) She was a nurse before she involuntarily retired, and I still occasionally go to her for medical tidbits (like how to perform a spinal tap). Also, I was pre-med for a bit. I wanted to be a veterinarian when I first entered college, but once I realized I didn't have the drive for it, I switched majors to English. (I'm also on the Emergency Response Team at work, so I'm being trained to handle medical emergencies and so on.)

And, yes, I watch all sorts of "true life" medical shows. Forensic medicine, operations, trauma centers, maternity clinics, the works. I love the stuff. I can watch someone's hip being routed out for the marrow while I eat a plate full of sphagetti. :D

And thank you for the supreme compliment. Michael Crichton is my favorite author. I've been hooked on his hyper-realistic stule since my mom introduced me to Andromeda Strain in 6th grade. :blush
Also, when reading 'Crawlers bio, it says 'and a small amount of aditional mass around him.' Does that mean that he could teleport a chair with him if he were standing next to it?(A small one)
And has the effects of him teleporting too much mass ever come up in the comics? Does he just get a nosebleed, go into shock, or anything like that?
I think he has to be in contact with the object to take it with him. I've never seen an instance of him taking anything he isn't touching. I remember seeing him try to t'port something with too much mass, during a danger room exercise. It hurt like a sunuvabitch, left him crumpled on the floor for a second or two, but the object didn't materialize with him. He didn't have a nosebleed at that point. Another time, during X-Men annual #5 (early '80s), he had to teleport both Wolverine (who's bad enough, considering his heavy metal skeleton) and another person at the same time. He succeeded, but did indeed go into shock. The stress almost killed him.

These two instances had a similar problem (too much mass), but vastly different environments. One was just a training excercise. Dangerous, yes, but not lethal. The other was a case of "if I don't get them out, they'll die". He didn't have the incentive to push himself past the brink in the first situation, but in the second, he did.

Of course, at that time the comics code was in strict effect, and one didn't show blood if it could be helped, even with Wolvie's rampages. That might be why they didn't have NC bleeding from the nose or ears. Now, he'd probably have his face covered in blood for effect. Considering that a nosebleed is often caused by high blood pressure and stress, it's perfectly concievable that he'd get those if he pushes himself too far.
Eagles may soar, but weasels never get sucked into the intake of a jet engine..... :evil
Nightcrawler ZERO
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 489
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2002 8:58 pm
Location: Home= MA School= GA
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Nightcrawler ZERO »

Nightcrawler never teleported another person until the Phoenix Saga. When he teleported Lilandra, the strain left him unconcious for pretty much the rest of the issue. The next time he had to take that risk was with Wolverine, whose adamantium bones added an extra 100 lbs of mass. He seemed to recover in about the same time it took to recover from teleporting Lilandra. Over time, his resitance built up.....

Unlike show-off Who succesfully phased Colossus on her first attempt with no ill affect besides Storm catching them smooching in her attic........
thylacine
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 290
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2003 6:51 pm
Location: the suburbs

Teleportation Concept

Post by thylacine »

Please, whatever you do! Don't hurt the kitty! Experiment with my neighbor's mean German Shepard instead!!!
User avatar
Nightgamer
Bilge Rat
Bilge Rat
Posts: 63
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2003 2:45 pm

Teleportation Concept

Post by Nightgamer »

dude, if PETA ever finds out about this thread, were all skrewd
:icey acolyte of iceman :icey
:kiwi acolyte of kiwi :kiwi
:avalanche avalanche is cool too :avalanche

Coalition for 'Crawler to Carry a Cutlass :bamf(CCCC) Member #35 :bamf
User avatar
DZX9
Lubber
Lubber
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 12:20 am
Location: Elsewhere

Teleportation Concept

Post by DZX9 »

Since he doesn't get hurt by dust in the air (over several teleports it would start to build up inside him) and we never see him teleporting into a fly or other such bug, which would clearly hurt someone, I think we can assume there is matter displacement taking place around him.

I was reading Ultimate X-Men (great comic) where Kurt was making his getaway in car and teleported the whole car with him. But before that he passed out from teleporting with a snowmobile.

I have a feeling Weapon X was building up the amount of mass he could teleport, but not his distance since later on there is a reference that he could only teleport 2 miles. I just figured the confines of the building were his limit so distance couldn't be tested.
DZX9
Nightcrawler ZERO
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 489
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2002 8:58 pm
Location: Home= MA School= GA
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Nightcrawler ZERO »

Quite possibly the problem isn't too do with the fact that matter is there, but the propertys of the matter. If it were something he could displace or destroy by hand (Gasses, Liquids, soft/fragile solids) the force of the 'port would be enough to displace the matter, but if the matter is strong enough (Mettal, for example) he can't force it away before he materializes, and then would merge with it, quite messily. The solution to this problem would be to teleport with Kitty, having her phase, so that no matter where they land, there's no risk.
User avatar
Orangatan64
Bilge Rat
Bilge Rat
Posts: 64
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2003 6:51 am
Location: Mobile, Al.

Teleportation Concept

Post by Orangatan64 »

Originally posted by Nightcrawler ZERO
Quite possibly the problem isn't too do with the fact that matter is there, but the propertys of the matter. If it were something he could displace or destroy by hand (Gasses, Liquids, soft/fragile solids) the force of the 'port would be enough to displace the matter, but if the matter is strong enough (Mettal, for example) he can't force it away before he materializes, and then would merge with it, quite messily. The solution to this problem would be to teleport with Kitty, having her phase, so that no matter where they land, there's no risk.
Yes. But that would lead to the eventual 'teleporting blind' scenario. If Kitty did phase as Kurt teleported, they would eventually get bold enough to try to teleprt anywhere without seeing it first. And no matter how safe you are if your in phase, I believe that it is limited to how long the both of them can hold their breaths. Asumming they teleported into a mountain too far, for example.
"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so." - Douglas Adams.
"The pen is mightier than the sword, and considerably easier to write with." - Marty Feldman.
"If toast always lands butter-side down, and cats always land on their feet, what happens if you strap toast on the back of a cat and drop it?" - Steven Wright.
Gaz
Deck Swabber
Deck Swabber
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 6:41 pm
Location: Portland
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Gaz »

Actually, the holding breath rule is just for Kitty. For Kurt, it's like a two mile or so distance he can port to; it's not measured by time but by distance. But Kitty can phase for as long as she can hold her breathe.
DeviantArt | Live Journal
---------------------------------------

Stan: Can Eric spend the night?
Mrs. Cartman: No, I'm sorry, Eric is grounded
for trying to exterminate the Jews last week.
Nightcrawler ZERO
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 489
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2002 8:58 pm
Location: Home= MA School= GA
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Nightcrawler ZERO »

And if they did blind port into a mountain, they could blind port out- they'd both be phsed- no harm done.
Gaz
Deck Swabber
Deck Swabber
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 6:41 pm
Location: Portland
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Gaz »

Originally posted by Nightcrawler ZERO
And if they did blind port into a mountain, they could blind port out- they'd both be phsed- no harm done.
That doesn't make sense! He would just end up bamfing into the matter that is inside the moutain (rock, soil, etc) Yes, if there wasn't a risk of bamfing into objects, i.e. if Kurt could phase, then blind bamfing wouldn't be a threat. But it is. :eek
DeviantArt | Live Journal
---------------------------------------

Stan: Can Eric spend the night?
Mrs. Cartman: No, I'm sorry, Eric is grounded
for trying to exterminate the Jews last week.
Nightcrawler ZERO
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 489
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2002 8:58 pm
Location: Home= MA School= GA
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Nightcrawler ZERO »

Well, what I was saying was that if he was porting with Kitty as a passenger, and she kept them phased, there would be no risk.
Gaz
Deck Swabber
Deck Swabber
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 6:41 pm
Location: Portland
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Gaz »

Yeah, that could work, as long as they could hold their breaths, but we don't know if Kitty would be able to hold her breath through the bamfing process. It would probably be too dangerous to test. Plus, if Kitty was phasing when they bamfed, Kurt wouldn't be touching her. Wouldn't that just make him leave her behind?
DeviantArt | Live Journal
---------------------------------------

Stan: Can Eric spend the night?
Mrs. Cartman: No, I'm sorry, Eric is grounded
for trying to exterminate the Jews last week.
User avatar
Entropy
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 237
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2002 1:23 pm

Teleportation Concept

Post by Entropy »

Kurt can teleport a lot more now. he was a guest in extreme x-men about a year ago and teleported jean, hank, and logan. that's a great deal of mass. Austen also increased the range that he can teleport (although i still suspect that certain directions are easier than others).

in AoA he teleported dead man wade's (that world's version of deadpool) head off w/ no ill effect, and i believe there was one other time that he has done it (excluding the robot incident).

the ultimate x-men incident of snow-mobile vs car, it could be that he was already tired from trying to escape.

what i'd like to see is the writers play more w/ the directional teleportation thing.
Dave, your creations brought joy to my life and inspired my imagination. R.I.P.

Insanity is all in the mind...
Shadow_Dancer
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 411
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 12:06 am
Location: Seventh Heaven

Teleportation Concept

Post by Shadow_Dancer »

One of my favorite Excaliburs deals with the vertical limits of Kurt's teleportation.

He highdive's off their lighthouse headquarters and bamfs after he hits the water, but can't make it all the way back to the top, so he falls in a dive back into the water. But his second bamf fizzles leaving him deep under water and not knowing which way is up. Rachel has to save him. At that time he is still weak from his months in a coma and is trying to get his ablities back.


He's also dressed in a Speedo *fans self*
That's why it's one of my favorite issues ;)
"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream." Mark Twain

Shadow Dancer's Fanfic Archive Image
Nightcrawler ZERO
Butt Monkey
Butt Monkey
Posts: 489
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2002 8:58 pm
Location: Home= MA School= GA
Contact:

Teleportation Concept

Post by Nightcrawler ZERO »

Kitty has phased other people before. There really is no reason this couldn't work, from a physical standpoint. The only issue is if Kitty could maintain the concentration to be phased throughout the port. Also, this wouldn't be used for any period longer than they could hold thier breaths- just for scouting out unknown areas.

Did Kitty ever fully recover from the injuries that made her default state be phased?
Post Reply