X-Force General Discussion Thread

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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:16 pm

I think I may have seen that cover. Are there a lot of other X-Men and villains involved also?
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:18 pm

It's just AoA people charging the X-Force team. Not too unlike classic Uncanny X-Men cover where Cockrum's gang is charging Stan Lee's gang with X in the middle.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby tears~fall~like~glass » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:20 pm

X-force is going to the AoA timeline for technology to save Angel, and they end up fighting the X-men there.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 4:00 pm

*cough*Lame*cough*.

*cough*MarvelCanDoBetterIfTheyExpectThatToMakeKurtFansBuyAPoorComicWithPoorNumbers*cough*
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Angelique » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:44 pm

Ult_Sm86 wrote:So far he seems to be a jimminy-cricket type hallucination. A conscience on Logan's behalf I suppose.

However; Kurt is officially on the cover (in AoA form) for Uncanny X-Force.


Their job is to kill things, so I imagine he's not gonna make it out of that fight alive.


I have absolutely zero interest in seeing any iteration of Nightcrawler killed again. As for Wolverine 8, (spoilers)










...however, Kurt doesn't seem to be a hallucination. In fact, he denied it when asked if he was just a bit of Wolverine's subconscious, even though "Jean" did not deny Emma's claim about her. "Jean" was behind a door, like Wolverine's other memories and thoughts, but Kurt wandered about freely.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Thu Apr 21, 2011 7:27 pm

Both comics would be of interest to me, but the one with Logan moreso than the other. I'll have to start looking for them. Thanks much for the info!
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby neling4 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:54 am

Karl wrote:Is that the one where he's dressed like a pirate, with a sword and all? I haven't gotten it yet, but I saw a scan of one of the panels on another CBR Forum.


Does anyone have a link to that scan? I've been awol from comics and comic sites for a few months and am sadly behind on any Nighty News. Thanks! :)
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Fri Apr 22, 2011 1:20 pm

It's on the CBR Forum for NC, called "It Ain't Easy Being Blue". Here's the link to the page: http://forums.comicbookresources.com/sh ... 3&page=181

BTW, this is an interesting and pretty active forum, for anyone who might be interested. Lots of illos, fanart, scans, etc.
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Postby Ult_Sm86 » Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:52 pm

I think I'm gonna get the trade of that "Wolverine" arc where Nightcrawler shows up. Can't bring myself to spend money on multiple issue of Wolverine comics. :/
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Angelique » Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:31 pm

I just bought two issues, as it seems as if those will be the only two issues with Nightcrawler in them, and issue 8 covered the important details of the previous issues so well in the recap page, that I started reading already knowing what I needed to follow the story.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:30 pm

Is the TPB out yet? If not, and Kurt doesn't appear again, it might be worth buying just #8, since it seems to have the most stuff dealing with Kurt in it. (I haven't gotten #7 yet. My subscription started with 8.) However, I really liked the Wolverine Goes to hell part, which is 1-5, so if that also appears in the same TPB, it might be worth it. Logan is my second-favorite character and I like what they are doing with him lately. Yeah, there's still all kinds of silly fighting going on, but now there's some psychological and symbolic stuff happening also.
Haven't seen the AoA comic yet, but I'll be going by the local comic store in a couple of weeks and may get it then, along with #6 & 7.
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Postby Blob55 » Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:21 am

Just saw bits of this issue... It looks like Marvel is listening to Nightcrawler fans and they may be slowly bringing him back.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Fri Apr 29, 2011 1:07 pm

So far, Kurt appears to be a sort of spirit, come from heaven to help Logan fight his demons. Dunno if he'll be here for long, but it would be nice.
BTW, I like what the new Wolverine series is doing with Logan. First they sent his soul to hell, now they are dissecting his mind, psychologically speaking. Has anyone seen the drawings at the end of #8, where the berserker part of him is portrayed as a furious, bloody version of himself wrapped in barbed wire? I found that to be a very powerful and disturbing image of something that doesn't only haunt the mind of the Wolverine, but lives in all of us, however deeply it may be buried.
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Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Sun May 08, 2011 1:45 am

Ohai, guys I'm back! Kinda disappeared on y'all for a while there...

So I just read Wolverine 8. What's everybody else thinking about this???

Spoilers below....

















So... Kurt managed to come into Logan's mind.... the same time that DEMONS did? -_- Am I the only one making the connection here? Some of you might recall that I got flowers the week Nightcrawler died, apparently from Marvel - telling me that "the demon origin you hate so much may be the way he comes back to life." Is it possible that Kurt's soul has been trapped in some way in some kind of demonic realm, and when they came through to Logan, Kurt also came back and is hanging onto Logan as a lifeline to the real world?

Also, I totally agree with Angie about the whole "is he real" thing - Kurt not only denied being fake and wasn't behind a door, but also apparently had some real capabilities to change things.

On a side note, I totally loved the "Sexual Fantasies" door and Emma's reaction - made me lol.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Sun May 08, 2011 1:57 pm

Not quite the same time. The demons were there already, since they had taken over his body when Logan's soul was sent to hell. Or did I miss something somewhere?
I agree that Kurt seems to be real in some way or another, as distinct from the other characters being taken from Logan's mind. Best I can think of is that he's a spiritual being of some kind, whatever that might be. It would sure be nice if he would show up again, but I don't dare hope for that.
As for the doors, I'd have liked to have seen what was behind the one marked "X-Men I've Had Sex With.
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Postby Ult_Sm86 » Sun May 08, 2011 3:22 pm

You're correct Karl, and I'm gonna have to agree with you. Having read the issue (Yeah I spent the money, I'm a moron), I'd have to say that it feels like a shout out to get us to buy it and discuss it as we are doing now.

I asked Tom Brevoort and (naturally) he did not divulge a thing:
Question On Kurt's Return


[Edited on 8/5/11 by Ult_Sm86]
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Angelique » Sun May 08, 2011 8:12 pm

Ult_Sm86 wrote:You're correct Karl, and I'm gonna have to agree with you. Having read the issue (Yeah I spent the money, I'm a moron), I'd have to say that it feels like a shout out to get us to buy it and discuss it as we are doing now.

I asked Tom Brevoort and (naturally) he did not divulge a thing:
Question On Kurt's Return


[Edited on 8/5/11 by Ult_Sm86]


Well naturally he doesn't seem to care that some fans may feel a bit jerked around...
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Postby Karl » Sun May 08, 2011 10:52 pm

Come on now, did you really expect him to tell us exactly what Marvel plans, if anything, for Kurt? They may not even know yet. They may be experimenting to find out if very many fans are interested enough in seeing him to make any noticeable difference in the sales figures for issues with him in them. In the final analysis, Marvel is a business enterprise out to make a profit. To them, Nightcrawler is just one of many characters, any one of whom can be used in whatever way they can think of that will sell comics. He's not something special, as he is to us. Would you rather Kurt didn't appear now and then, just so we wouldn't feel possibly manipulated?
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Postby Angelique » Mon May 09, 2011 2:47 am

It's more than just that. It's simply bad business to kill any licensed intellectual properties. It results in bizarre tactics to maintain the trademark, such as post-mortem appearances, mentions, flashbacks, appearances of AU versions, ripoff characters that look the same and have similar power sets, and of course the cliche resurrection story.

As for Mr. Brevoort, he's actually made some remarks about Nightcrawler and Alpha Flight that show particular insensitivity. It goes a bit beyond nondisclosure.
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Postby Ult_Sm86 » Mon May 09, 2011 3:40 am

Karl, I was sorta just prodding and poking in hopes for soem kind of hint. i didn't really expect any result and I think he knew that. And don't write off Mr. Brevoort's understanding of the character to the fans so quickly, he knows everyone has their favorite. He doesn't write anyones love off, not until they get unreasonable/unruly to him.

He knows Kurt is missed, he also knows how much more pointless it would make his death to just whip him back randomly.
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Angelique » Mon May 09, 2011 6:59 am

Ult_Sm86 wrote:He knows Kurt is missed, he also knows how much more pointless it would make his death to just whip him back randomly.


Quite frankly, I don't see how his death could be any more pointless than how it's already been made.
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Postby Ult_Sm86 » Mon May 09, 2011 7:08 am

Thankfully that's not what the discussion is about.


If his return is imminent then we have a lot of other discussions to look forward to, such as the potential return of a Margali Szardos plot, possibly involving Logan. Maybe Magik will become relevant in the Wolverine title, assuming that if they do plan on drawing out a Kurt return within this title of course.

There's also...

What the hell happened to Azazel? And now that he's being used as a member of the Villainous Hellfire Club (aptly named now more than ever) in the upcoming X-Men First Class flick is this a hint his relevance may become a re-explored event in the comics?
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Mon May 09, 2011 1:19 pm

Angelique and Ult_Sm86,
In truth, I hope you're right and there's someone at Marvel who cares about Kurt and is understanding of his fans' interest. Maybe I'm too cynical, or expect too little from large businesses. Or maybe it's just that I've had this happen once before in a fandom in which I was very involved. They killed off one of the two main characters; kept him dead for an entire TV season, despite the outcry from his fans; "resurrected" him as an AU version during that season; and gave out hints that we should keep hoping for the return of the original. Yes, his death generated some very emotional episodes and much publicity. Yes, they returned the original character to life at the end of the season. But the ratings had fallen so badly that the show went off the air halfway thru the next season, to everyone's dismay.
So maybe all this just seems too familiar to me. But I hope I'm wrong and things work out better this time around.

As for the upcoming movie, I'll reserve judgement about that until after I've seen it.
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Postby Ult_Sm86 » Mon May 09, 2011 2:20 pm

Why do I feel like I know the show you're talking about...

Is it a Stargate?
Also, don't be so pessimistic. Of course someone somewhere in the company cares about the fans. It's bad business not to. They also have to care about the fact that they're an industry, and they are selling a product to you.

Everyone acts like comic books are this recently sold out artistic enterprise, but I have news for those people, comic books have sold out a long damn time ago. It's a business. If a character dies, it would be bad business to just fling him back to life and not give the readers who appreciated the character a good story to explain why his return even needed to happen.

Azazel is an example of Marvel slipping up and not giving you the best they could offer. If they're smart, they'll pick up that Chuck botched up a potentially good origins story and they'll utilize the new movie to re-address (possibly even retcon) some of the events during his Uncanny Run and it may just even result in Kurt's return. Inner demons, head tricks, and Logan on a killing rampage? Sounds like he could use a visit from a devil. :azazel
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X-Force General Discussion Thread

Postby Karl » Mon May 09, 2011 3:23 pm

No, not STARGATE. It was HERCULES: The Legendary Journeys. Hercules wasn't killed off. It was his buddy Iolaus.

Logan just had a visit with the Devil when he went to Hell. (I liked that sequence, BTW. I even subscribed to the new Wolverine series, since I liked where it seems to be going: psychological action, not just all fighting action.)

I don't think the movie should even be bringing in Azazel, especially not as Kurt's father, if they go that route. However, as I said, I'll wait until I actually see the movie. Maybe I'll like it.
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